Between Magic and Mount Justice HP/Young Justice Xover

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 8th, 2013, 5:32 pm

What exactly be the problem with Gryffindor?

Whatever other qualities this Harry has the overriding one is that he puts his own life in danger to help people he doesn't even know on a daily basis.

I can see Harry trying to get into Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff (this Harry would find out enough about Slytherin to know that would be a bad idea) because he thinks he will be more at home with them, but the sorting hat will be inclined to put him in Gryffindor.
There's not really any problem with Gryffindor, as you say, Harry would fit in there. However, he would also fit in the other houses just as well. From the Harry Potter Wiki:

Gryffindor - bravery, daring, nerve, and chivalry.
Hufflepuff - loyalty, fair play, honesty, and tolerance.
Ravenclaw - wit, creativity, and wisdom.
Slytherin - ambition, cleverness, cunning, resourcefulness, and pure blood heritage.

Apart from a few (wisdom, pure blood heritage, chivalry), Harry fits all of them. This is the problem with creating well-rounded characters. They don't fit descriptors nearly as well as flat characters.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Bezzerker » January 8th, 2013, 5:48 pm

Just because Harry does help many people every day even if they don't know it doesn't necessarily mean that is his biggest trait. Batman also goes out of his way to save the general populace of Gotham every day, but most people would consider his intelligence and resourcefulness to be his biggest traits. Something which I think Batman would have taught Harry to value as well. I would expect in this story to see Harry attempt to investigate how the spells he is taught actually work. He would naturally start by asking those who have more knowledge in this regard such as the teachers, but if they tell him "that's just how it is," I doubt Harry would be satisfied with that sort of answer.

MrRigger2, here is how the wiki describes where and how to get into the Hufflepuff dorms.
The Hufflepuff dormitories and common room entrance "is concealed in a stack of large barrels in a nook on the right hand side of the kitchen corridor." To enter, one must tap the barrel two from the bottom in the middle of the second row in the rhythm of 'Helga Hufflepuff'. Unlike any other house, the Hufflepuff common room has a repelling device that douses the illegal entrant in vinegar if the wrong lid is tapped or the rhythm is wrong
Note: The repelling device does NOT distinguish whether the person is a Hufflepuff or not, just if someone got the pattern wrong. If someone from another house performs the pattern correctly, they would be allowed entry.

EDIT: The wikipedia page for Hogwarts has a slightly different list of the traits for each house.

Ravenclaw doesn't have wisdom, it has learning and intelligence instead;
Slytherin doesn't officially have blood-purity listed, just that people who care about it are more likely to be sorted into the house. (Both Snape and Voldemort are notable half-blood Slytherins)
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 8th, 2013, 6:39 pm

Part Seven! Wanted to get this up before I had to go to work, so it's short. Covers the important parts, though.
Spoiler: show
Harry and Bruce followed Alfred into the parlor where Professor McGonagall was waiting. “Mr. Potter, Mr. Wayne, it is good to see you again. Thank you for having me back again. Have you made a decision?”

“Right down to business, I see?” Bruce joked.

“I don’t mean to be short, but international travel is a bit taxing on me. I’m not as young as I once was.”

“Then I suppose I shouldn’t keep you too long, then. Harry?”

“I think I want to do it. Hogwarts sounds like it would be a good thing for me, even if I’m nervous about doing it.”

“Trust me, Mr. Potter, you’ve made the right decision.”

“There are a few things I want to cover first, though,” Bruce qualified. “First thing, safety.”

“Hogwarts is one of the safest places I know of. Ancient wards protect the school, and it has been safe from attack for a thousand years.”

“That may be, but it’s also not really what I was referring to. I’ve made a number of enemies over the years, because that’s what happens when you’re the head of a billion dollar company. Doesn’t really matter what I do, people always seem to find a way to get angry with me. Honestly, I could say the sky is blue and I’d have a group of protesters on my doorstep the next morning. But what I’m trying to say is that I have enemies who would do anything to hurt me, including go after Dick or Harry. They both have panic buttons in case of emergency for here in Gotham, but I’d like something in place for while Harry is at your school.”

“Mr. Wayne, I’m not sure that’s necessary,” McGonagall began.

“I do, and I’m willing to finance whatever solution we come up with. Money’s not really an issue.”

“Well, it’s not usually done, but I will talk to Headmaster Dumbledore about securing an emergency Portkey for Mr. Potter’s use.”

“What’s a Portkey?” Harry asked.

McGonagall slipped into teacher mode. “A Portkey is a magical form of transportation, able to teleport the user to a specified destination. It can be any object, though it’s typically something unobtrusive and uninteresting so that no one other than the intended user will pick it up and accidentally set it off. There are no real functional limits on the distance a Portkey can travel, but it does take a skilled creator to make a Portkey that can travel across international distances. There are wards that can stop a Portkey from reaching its destination, though. However, general consensus is that Portkeys over long distances are somewhat uncomfortable and difficult for the untrained witch or wizard to create, so other methods of magical travel are in more widespread use.”

“Well, assuming we can agree on a suitable arrival point, that would work. Second, travel arrangements. I didn’t see anything regarding where your school is, or how Harry will be getting there.”

“The Hogwarts Express departs from Kings Cross in London on September 1st, and though typically students are expected to make their way to Kings Cross on their own terms, I expect we could provide a Portkey if necessary.”

“No, I haven’t been to England for a while, I could take the opportunity to take a look at my European holdings. Alfred, could you make sure it gets on my calendar? Rearrange anything that needs it. And third, where am I suppose to get some of these things on the equipment list? The clothes shouldn’t be a problem, I can just have my tailor take care of those, and I’m sure I can track down the rest with some time, but if there’s some order system set up, that would probably be easier, wouldn’t it?”

“You’re ahead of most Muggles with just that, but Harry could pick up everything on the list at Diagon Alley in London.”

Bruce furrowed his brow. “You said that yesterday, what does it mean?”

“it’s not an insult, if that’s what you’re wondering. It’s just the general term for anyone who can’t use magic, like yourself.”

Bruce nodded. “Well, if you could give us directions to this Diagon Alley, I’ll make sure Harry has anything he may need for the school year. Now, if you’ll excuse me, I have some meetings in town that I can’t reschedule, but it’s been nice talking to you, Professor.”

McGonagall stood. “Actually, Mr. Wayne, I have a Portkey back to London right now. If you would allow it, I’d be willing to escort Mr. Potter around Diagon Alley and make sure he has anything he may need. That way, he would have more than a month to study his textbooks and get ready as opposed to being rushed if you had to wait until the last minute.”

Bruce paused. “Alfred, would you be willing to tag along, make sure Harry doesn’t get into trouble?”

“Well, I had planned to polish the silver today, Master Bruce, but I suppose that could wait until this evening.”

Bruce clapped his hands together. “Excellent! I wanted to drive myself in today, anyways. Is the Jag gassed up?”

“Alas, Master Bruce, I believe you’ll have to content yourself with the Porsche or the Aston Martin.”
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 8th, 2013, 9:42 pm

Part Eight! Because running House Lights for Beauty and the Beast means I have to push a button four times over the course of two and a half hours!
Spoiler: show
Harry, Alfred, and Professor McGonagall stood outside the Leaky Cauldron, the cab having deposited them on the sidewalk. “Hardly the gateway to the center of commerce I expected,” Alfred murmured.

McGonagall sighed. “I’ve told Tom time and again that he needs to clean this place up, make a better impression on those entering our world, but no, he has his business and he’s not going to change it, no matter how much of a good idea it may be. It’s why he did so poorly in Transfiguration, no sort of mind for change.”

She brushed an invisible wrinkle out of her coat. “So, shall we be off? Much to do, no time to waste.” Without waiting for a response, she walked into the dirty pub and through to the back door, not pausing for a second.

McGonagall counted out the bricks and tapped with her wand, the wall unfolding and opening into a busy street, filled to bursting with witches and wizards.

“Well,” Alfred remarked, “that’s somewhat more impressive.”

“Quite.”

0oOo0

After their visit to Gringotts, where they stocked up on enough gold to cover the costs of the trip, and Alfred reclaimed Harry’s key from Professor McGonagall, they headed for Madam Malkin’s for Harry’s new wardrobe.

Once Alfred settled on an appropriate material (drawing an irritated glance from Madam Malkin), Harry was instructed to stand on the platform and stay still so he wouldn’t get pricked.

“So young man, which House do you think you’ll be in? Professor McGonagall’ll take care of you just fine if you end up in Gryffindor.”

“I like to think I take care of all my students, not just those in my House.”

“Um, what do you mean by Houses?”

“I haven’t gotten quite around to explaining them yet, Mr. Potter.” Madam Malkin started to react as she realized who her client was, but McGonagall stopped her with a stare. “I am the Head of Gryffindor House, one of the four Houses named after the Hogwarts founders. Gryffindor, Slytherin, Ravenclaw, and Hufflepuff. All four have long histories and have produced great witches and wizards through the years. Both your parents were in Gryffindor, and finer examples I have rarely seen.

“Gryffindors tend to be brave and chivalrous, though this has a tendency to translate to brashness and arrogance if one doesn’t watch their ego. People tend to think of Gryffindors as the ‘heroes’, but I’m ashamed to say that just as many bullies come from my House as those that stand up for the downtrodden.

“Slytherins are known for their ambition and cunning, as well as their cleverness and resourcefulness. You may find some who claim that Slytherin is the ‘evil’ or ‘Dark’ House, but those people are simply misinformed. Slytherins may be consummate planners and schemers, but just as many use their talents for good as ill, and there’s been no more Dark Wizards that come from there than any of the other Houses.

“Ravenclaws prize wit and wisdom above all, and usually take the top scores in the year, though they sometimes fall into the trap of failing to realize that knowledge does not equal experience, and that just because you’ve learned something, it doesn’t mean you know all there is to the subject. Still, if you find yourself in need of tutoring, you’ll never find a better study partner than someone from Ravenclaw.

“Hufflepuffs seem to be constantly underestimated, and I have no idea why. Hufflepuff is filled with hard workers, loyal and just, and you’ll never find a better friend. Their Head of House, Pomona Sprout, teaches Herbology, and she is perhaps my favorite person on staff. Of course, if you manage to offend one, you’ll doubtlessly offend them all, and they’ll work diligently to see their revenge fulfilled. I hope you’ll never make that mistake, Mr. Potter.

“You will likely hear talk about which House is the best, or most superior, but no matter which House you end up, you’ll do well. Every House has their own grand traditions, and at each, you’ll be receiving a Hogwarts education, which is the most important part.”

“Wow. That’s… a lot to take in.”

“It’s not really too complex, once you get to Hogwarts and see the system in action. Of course, those are also just general characterizations, and people will always find a way to surprise you. Don’t assume you know how a person will react simply because you know what House they happen to be in.”

0oOo0

After making their way through the Apothecary, the Bookstore, and Ollivander’s Wand Shop, as well as stopping at a few other specialty stores to pick up the rest of Harry’s supplies, McGonagall guided them in the direction of Quality Quidditch Supplies.

“Professor, as I recall, there was a note in the acceptance letter that first years would not be allowed their own broomsticks,” Alfred noted as they walked in.

“Very perceptive, Mr. Pennyworth, but I have been meaning to upgrade my current broom for some time. And if Mr. Potter wished to borrow my new broom once he has been properly trained and is caught up on his schoolwork, I would be amenable to loaning it to him. And if he were to keep it after the school year ended, well, then he could just consider it ten years worth of overdue birthday presents and an apology from an old woman who failed to keep track of him as well as she should have.”

0oOo0

The Portkey deposited the trio in front of the Wayne Estate Grounds, and they all took a moment to steady themselves. McGonagall recovered first. “Now then, I’ll see you on the first of September, Mr. Potter. I recommend you study your books before you arrive, as preparation will only help you succeed.

“And Mr. Pennyworth, could I perhaps trouble you for the name of that tea you served me?”

“If you can wait a moment, I shall retrieve you a bag, Professor.”

“Thank you. And please, call me Minerva.”

“Only if you call me Alfred.”

Harry looked back and forth between the two, decided it was best not to think about it, and ran for the Manor.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby DIT_grue » January 8th, 2013, 10:33 pm

Part six: "wound down" not "winded down"

Part seven: The question needs to be more specific or McGonagall should ask for clarification. Clearer rephrasings: “You said that yesterday, but what does 'muggle' mean?” or “You used that word yesterday too, but what does it mean?” (Unless you're trying to show that she was expecting the query because this is part of her routine for introducing the families of muggleborns to magic - troll the word as often as necessary to make them ask, then reassure them that of course there's no prejudice involved. :roll: If that's what you're aiming for, I think it needs to be pointed up a little more, but I'm not sure how to do that.)
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby jgkitarel » January 9th, 2013, 11:55 am

The thing is, there is prejudice involved, though McGonnagal may honestly believe that there isn't, or simply convinced herself that the days of such prejudice are a thing of the past. Also, Bruce would have certainly expected and known that she did not tell everything he would have wanted to know about the magical world. It's not her job, since she is there to convince Harry to attend and to convince Bruce to let him attend. She would not have lied, but there are things she would have taken for granted that she would not have thought to discuss and give Bruce an opening.

She wouldn't lie about things, but again, there are aspects of the magical community that she takes for granted and would not think that it was important to discuss.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 9th, 2013, 2:41 pm

The thing is, there is prejudice involved, though McGonnagal may honestly believe that there isn't, or simply convinced herself that the days of such prejudice are a thing of the past. Also, Bruce would have certainly expected and known that she did not tell everything he would have wanted to know about the magical world. It's not her job, since she is there to convince Harry to attend and to convince Bruce to let him attend. She would not have lied, but there are things she would have taken for granted that she would not have thought to discuss and give Bruce an opening.

She wouldn't lie about things, but again, there are aspects of the magical community that she takes for granted and would not think that it was important to discuss.
This is a very good point, and will come up the first time Harry tries to contact home electronically.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 10th, 2013, 12:20 am

Part Nine! Didn't think I'd get this part out today, but I figure I've done at least a part each day so far, might as well keep it up as long as possible.
Spoiler: show
Harry spent the next week studying his new schoolbooks, trying to get a feel for the subjects. Even as he read, his mind was running through ways to use the subjects, though not all of them were jumping out as immediately helpful. He was pretty sure that the only way Astronomy was going to be helpful would be if Riddler went on a space kick. Though if Isley ever got her hands on anything from his Herbology book, she’d be twice as terrifying, and really, she hardly need the help. But all in all, there was a lot of theory, and not as much practical instruction. Which made sense, you didn’t want overzealous kids blowing themselves up without a teacher there to watch them do it.

Still, no amount of new information could get Harry to forget about his birthday when it rolled around on Saturday. The fact that it was being held at Mount Justice was just a bonus.

Dick had already gone ahead earlier in the morning, so when Harrier and Batman walked into the kitchen/living room, everything was already set up, streamers criss-crossing the ceiling and a banner above the kitchen bar.

“Happy Birthday!”

The whole Team was there, Robin, Aqualad, Kid Flash, even the members he doesn’t know very well, Superboy, Artemis, and Miss Martian. Batman was obviously there as well, since they came together, and Red Tornado was off to one corner. But someone was missing.

“Hey, where’s Kent?”

Considering nobody on the Team had met Kent Nelson, apart from Robin, there were a bunch of confused looks. Red Tornado stepped forward. “Kent Nelson has not arrived as of this moment. Furthermore, League records show that he has not communicated with any known member for several days.”

Harrier’s face falls. “But he said he’d be here…”

Robin threw an arm around Harrier’s shoulders, squeezing briefly. “Don’t worry about it, he’ll show up. Now come on, we’ve got cake.”

Harrier twitched. “Cake?”

M’gann nodded. “Yup! I didn’t know what kind you liked, so I made chocolate and vanilla, and then I made another one for Wally, because hello Megan, everybody else is going to want to get cake too.”

“Hey!” Wally protested. “Actually, wait, no, that was a good idea.”

M’gann laughed. “So, what do you want to do first, Harrier? Cake or presents?”

“Cake, definitely cake,” Harrier nodded.

Everybody sang, even Batman and Red Tornado (though general consensus was that Red Tornado shouldn’t sing anymore), and Harrier blew out the candles.

“What’d you wish for?” Artemis asked as Robin tried to explain the whole concept to Superboy off to the side.

Harrier smirked and shook his head. “I can’t tell you that, it won’t come true. Don’t you know that?”

“Nah, I always told people. It’s easy when you wish for cake.”

“Man, that’s a good idea. Hey, where are the plates?”

“I’ve got them right here, Harrier,” M’gann said, floating the stack over. “I can serve, if you want.”

“I don’t care who serves it, as long as they do it now,” Harrier said

“Now you’re talking my language, kid,” Wally added.

0oOo0

After gorging themselves on cake and ice cream, the party settled into comfortable conversations, with everybody drifting around talking to one another. At least, until M’gann announced, “Present time!”

Everybody crowed around the couches and coffee table, jockeying for a good spot. “Here, open mine first,” M’gann urged.

Harrier ripped open the brightly colored package, and found a framed photo, a famous picture of the Gotham City skyline and surrounding area. “I heard you were going away for school, and thought it might be nice to be able to have a piece of home when you get there.”

“Thanks, Miss Martian. This is actually pretty cool.”

“Ooh, me next!” Wally dashed forward, depositing his present in Harrier’s lap.

It was a copy of Yen Sid’s hat from the Sorcerer’s Apprentice, blue with stars and moons. “I ran all the way down to Disneyworld to get it for you.”

Harrier put it on, the hat slightly too big, making his ears squat out and push down. “Thanks, Wally. It’s great.”

“You should probably open mine before I get upstaged any more than I already have,” Artemis muttered. It was just a Happy Birthday card with a bit of cash inside, but it wasn’t like Artemis knew Harrier very well.

Harrier shrugged. “Hey, it’s not like I’m going to turn down cash.”

“’swhat I figured.”

Red Arrow wasn’t in attendance, but he had sent along a card with a coupon for “Free admittance into R-rated movie of your choice.”

Superboy tossed a small package at Harrier, who caught it easily. It was a deck of cards with the Superman symbol on the back. “It’s so if you don’t like where you go, you’ll at least have something to do.”

“We’ll have to take the Jokers out before we send you off, though,” Robin joked as he pushed his present on Harrier. He tore open the wrapping and found a pair of sunglasses. “I programmed them with a full electronic heads-up display and recording suite. That way you can look nearly as awesome as me, and still be able to track what’s going on around you.”

“You got me Knight Vision glasses? Sweet!”

“It’s called Detective Mode,” Batman corrected, but Harrier wasn’t listening, he was opening Batman’s present. It was a very expensive, very high-end watch. “So you won’t be late to class.”

“I’m never late to class!”

“You overslept and were late to training this morning.”

“It’s my birthday!”

“So?”

Harrier fumed, but allowed himself to be distracted as Aqualad passed over his present, the last one of the day. Inside was a book bound with a material Harrier had never seen, and an Atlantean to English guidebook.

“It is a book on Atlantean sorcery, one of my favorites. It was given to me from King Orin’s personal library, and I want you to have it.”

“Wow, Kaldur, this is awesome. Really, I don’t know what to say.”

“No words are needed between true friends.”

Harrier just nodded. It had been a great birthday party. There had only been one black spot.

Kent Nelson never showed up.
What do you think of the presents? I tried to make them appropriate to the characters.

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Last edited by MrRigger2 on February 23rd, 2013, 7:51 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Tempest Kitsune » January 10th, 2013, 12:44 am

Harry is gonna be PISSED when he gets to Hogwarts and his present from Dick shorts out.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Bezzerker » January 10th, 2013, 1:12 am

If the glasses include some kind of hardening/shielding from EMPs, the glasses should be fine. Hopefully Robin actually thought to put something like that into the glasses, otherwise...

On a related note, what exactly causes electronics to short out at Hogwarts or around Harry Potter-style magic? At no point before in this story has any technology shown to be affected by this story's Harry. While it could be attributed to Harry using a different style of magic, his ability to cast still comes from the same source. Plus, McGonagall used magic while in the Wayne Manor without causing any adverse effects.

Is it simply the quantity of magical energy at the school? Or is it that magic doesn't necessarily cause problems intrinsically, it's just the way wizards are casting their spells that makes electronics go haywire?

Although I have not watched Young Justice, and only know a few of the characters from reading the wikipedia page, the presents seem to fit for the most part. The only one I think is strange is the Superman deck of cards from Superboy. My issue is more with the design on the cards than the cards themselves, my impression of Superboy was he didn't really want anything to do with Superman. Then again, if this story is from later in the continuity, then that would make more sense.

As I said, I have little knowledge of Young Justice, so anything issues I bring up are likely to be a result of my ignorance more often than not. I apologize if my advice and recommendations in this regard are of little help.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Phht » January 10th, 2013, 6:22 am

I'd have to say that having a single riddle for all students regardless of year level wouldn't seem an intelligent thing to do. And given that this is Ravenclaw, I would figure that it has a vast library of logic puzzles and riddles and selects one that is the proper difficulty level for whoever is trying to enter. Then again, the wizarding world does frequently seem to have random intelligence fails on stuff (for instance, access to the Restricted Section seems to be embarrassingly easy, or the apparent access method for the Hufflepuff dorms).

As to the glasses, I would figure that the Bat family would automatically add EMP hardening where they can on stuff because Batman's paranoid like that and trains it into his minio-- I mean, sidekicks. OTOH, does tech exist to EMP harden something on the scale of sunglasses yet, even in DCverse?

I think magic's effect on electronics is based on how saturated the area is with magic. I mean, in GoF, they had the whole floo travel and whatnot into the Dursley home with no ill effect (IIRC) on the electronics afterward. Flipside, a place like 12GP or Hogwarts has had a lot of magic use over a substantial amount of time, saturating the environment and structure with magic and that could be why electronics don't work at a place like Hogwarts. It'd be kinda like putting something in water that isn't waterproof. (This is my own opinion and may not be supported by word of god/canon that I might've forgotten about.)
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 10th, 2013, 7:30 am

I'm planning on having an actual scene explaining this later on, but no, tech isn't shorted out by Harry Potter style magic, Hogwarts's anti-tech field is a factor of the location. While we know that tech shorts out around Hogwarts, nothing seems to short out around Harry himself, so we can assume he doesn't exude an anti-tech field like a Dresden Files wizard. Face it, if Harry did short out electronics with his presence, we would have heard about it from Vernon (who would have had, for once, a legitimate complaint), and Hermione wouldn't have been surprised by the idea that electronics short out around Hogwarts when she was trying to figure out how Rita Skeeter was scooping what happened on Hogwarts grounds.
Although I have not watched Young Justice, and only know a few of the characters from reading the wikipedia page, the presents seem to fit for the most part. The only one I think is strange is the Superman deck of cards from Superboy. My issue is more with the design on the cards than the cards themselves, my impression of Superboy was he didn't really want anything to do with Superman. Then again, if this story is from later in the continuity, then that would make more sense.
Superboy is desperate for approval from Superman, who basically shuns him based on the fact that he feels violated by the fact that someone cloned him. I've seen it described as Superman believing he was de facto raped, and then told he had to take care of the resulting child, who is also a sixteen year old Tyke Bomb with serious anger issues. Is Superman making the right decision here? No. Is he making an understandable one? I believe so.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby jgkitarel » January 10th, 2013, 10:46 am

It should also be noted that it's modern electronics that don't work. The wizarding world does have some tech devices which run on magic, but are based on pre-1950s level technology. In other words, they precede the development of the integrated circuit and solid state electronics, which are much more vulnerable to electromagnetic interference. A Wizarding Wireless set is essentially a wireless radio with vacuum tubes and transistors, but modified to run off of magic.

I've looked at magic's effects on modern tech as more along the lines of a magic saturated area having large amounts of what effectively is a powerful electric current operating on a completely different phase from what modern electronics were designed for. Much like how plugging in something designed to work off of an AC current into a DC current tends to short out, if you're lucky. Me and a few friends managed to make a few things actually explode doing that.

It actually makes more sense than a deliberate anti-tech field, though I wouldn't put it past an enterprising wizard to learn how to do so by taking the time to actually learn about how electronics actually work.

Thus, you could make modern tech work in a magic saturated environment, but you would have to modify the tech and design shielding to protect its' circuits.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Bezzerker » January 10th, 2013, 11:52 am

MrRigger - Ah, suddenly that makes a lot more sense to me.

JGK - I agree that creating shielding for circuitry would allow for modern tech to work in magic saturated areas, but that is looking only from the standpoint of the tech being altered to fit in magical areas. Is there a way to alter how magic interacts with electronics, so that such shielding would not be be needed for every piece of technology?

I tend to think magic as having more of a general EMP effect. Somewhat like a nuclear power source; the radioactive material doesn't produce a current by itself, but when used in a certain way it can affect devices that do run on a current.

I ask because the next question would be could magic be integrated into modern technology? You've already pointed out that magic can in fact be integrated into older technology. The main problem I can see is if you go beyond building each piece of magically enhanced device individually and attempt to mass produce, the location would eventually become an unsuitable place to build the devices if magic starts shorting out electronics whenever it is used repeatedly over time.

That being said, I am a little surprised that no wizard has tried to study and enhance a gun with magic. Off the top of my head, only two spells would be needed to make a gun far more effective then it currently is. A spell, probably a ward type either at the back of the barrel or on the bullet casing itself, that absorbs any kinetic energy that is not moving in a certain direction and redirects it, and a spell that prevents or severely cuts down on wear and tear. This would eliminate recoil, potentially add around twice as much energy to a bullet if not more, and ensure the gun itself could handle the increased stress placed on it.

Any other spells you guys would like to have added to a gun? :twisted:

EDIT: I forgot to include a 'not' in one of the sentences. You'd think with my constantly looking over and previewing my post and fixing things I wouldn't have any mistakes like that... :lll__:
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby jgkitarel » January 10th, 2013, 12:46 pm

MrRigger - Ah, suddenly that makes a lot more sense to me.

JGK - I agree that creating shielding for circuitry would allow for modern tech to work in magic saturated areas, but that is looking only from the standpoint of the tech being altered to fit in magical areas. Is there a way to alter how magic interacts with electronics, so that such shielding would be be needed for every piece of technology?
Not every piece of technology. Most modern pieces of technology are based off of older models. The use of integrated circuits and solid state electronics is a matter of efficiency and miniaturization, rather than utility. Using older methodologies, you could make a modern computer, but it would be massive, a power hog and generate massive amounts of heat.

So, until a means of making modern tech work in a magically saturated environment without shielding is developed, to get the same benefits, you would have to go for either massive and inefficient, or shield the system. Also, shielding can be something as simple as a Faraday Cage for some pieces, while others may require full hardening.
I tend to think magic as having more of a general EMP effect. Somewhat like a nuclear power source; the radioactive material doesn't produce a current by itself, but when used in a certain way it can affect devices that do run on a current.

I ask because the next question would be could magic be integrated into modern technology? You've already pointed out that magic can in fact be integrated into older technology. The main problem I can see is if you go beyond building each piece of magically enhanced device individually and attempt to mass produce, the location would eventually become an unsuitable place to build the devices if magic starts shorting out electronics whenever it is used repeatedly over time.
That's the general assumption among fans, as it is something that is easily understood. Since the effect isn't the same as Dresden-esque wizards causing things to break spectacularly, it is the easiest explanation. On the mass production side, building the machines to mass produce the items you want made could easily built with inbuilt shielding, redundancies using older tech pieces and easily replaced parts.
That being said, I am a little surprised that no wizard has tried to study and enhance a gun with magic. Off the top of my head, only two spells would be needed to make a gun far more effective then it currently is. A spell, probably a ward type either at the back of the barrel or on the bullet casing itself, that absorbs any kinetic energy that is not moving in a certain direction and redirects it, and a spell that prevents or severely cuts down on wear and tear. This would eliminate recoil, potentially add around twice as much energy to a bullet if not more, and ensure the gun itself could handle the increased stress placed on it.

Any other spells you guys would like to have added to a gun? :twisted:
Aside from the fanon ban on firearms, who's to say some wizards haven't? Keep in mind that the Harry Potter series takes place in the United Kingdom, which has strict gun control laws, which can also apply to most of Europe in general. It's easily possible that European wizards, not having to worry about someone pulling a gun on them, haven't considered it.

A wizard in other parts of the world, where firearms are common, would almost certainly be aware of the possibilities and may have designed charms and such for use with a gun. Rowling herself said that between a muggle with a gun and a wizard with a wand, the muggle would win. Gun beats wand in a straight up fight. Thus, wizards in other parts of the world may have done so, or at least made sure that they are familiar with guns.

As for charms on a gun, one to minimize recoil would be a major help.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby someone » January 10th, 2013, 1:50 pm

I'd note that the muggle + gun > wizard + wand comment is in fact fanon.

For all we know a gun will never be an effective weapon against a wizard because a simple charm blocks all bullets after the first time one is used. And needing a muggle weapon to fight muggles? Preposterous.

On topic, there is a part of chapter eight that is suddenly in present tense. Is that on purpose?
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Atharyn » January 10th, 2013, 2:08 pm

It is worth noting that the Wizarding World really doesn't seem to want to have muggles anywhere near their children. I find it entirely plausible that specific areas, like Hogwarts, have a Dresden style "Murphyonic field" due to a specific enchantment. They obviously couldn't do that inside London, but other places?

.. and doesn't that just raise all sorts of interesting thoughts about the Bermuda Triangle?

As for the guns vs. wands debate I will point out a few things:
1: Guns can be used by practically anyone. (Note this doesn't mean they can be used with skill, just that they can be used.) A shotgun with buckshot would be reasonably effective even in the hands of a novice because a "near miss" could still clip the target.

2: Wands require a lot of training to use effectively in a fight. Most of Harry's classmates in canon don't know very much about self defense until Remus Lupin teaches them for a year and then the DA gets formed.

3: We do not know that a single spell can just block all bullets effortlessly - unless I've missed something in canon. Judging by JKR's world design I'd assume it would work like any other attack on a shielding spell. Each bullet would apply stress to the shield. Enough stress and the shield would fail. (I have no idea how many bullets would be needed for that to happen, however.)

4: Some guns (hunting or sniper rifles) have a very long range. From everything we have seen wands have a range equal to what their owner can see with the naked eye. Thus some guns will have a longer range than most spells, which ties into my next point..

5: Spells take time to travel a distance. They allow enough time to dodge them if you are reasonably fit and not surprised. Bullets generally don't. You might dive for cover, but you cannot dodge a bullet once the trigger has been pulled. Human reactions are just too slow.

6: In defense of wands, spells can do lots of things. I've listed a few combat-related examples below, but wands have a great deal of versatility when wielded by a creative and / or trained mind.
a: Transfigure a table into solid metal so you can hide behind it in safety.
b: Turn an attacker into a trout.
c: Set off a blast of light and sound like a flash-bang grenade.
d: Unleash a stream of fire similar to a flamethrower.
e: Cause explosions similar to a grenade (rocket-propelled or otherwise) - specifically Bombarda.

Logic is a great way to be entirely wrong with confidence, but these points have always made me believe that a gun is just as lethal a tool as a wand.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby jgkitarel » January 10th, 2013, 7:05 pm

I didn't intend to mean that there are no defenses against bullets, but most wizards would be ignorant of them, or wouldn't be fast enough to pull it off. A prepared wizard against your average person with a pistol would stand a better chance than a wizard ignorant of what a gun can do.

Guns have an advantage over a wand in the fact that they require relatively little training to use effectively, especially since the average range for a firefight is closer than 100 feet. It doesn't matter if the first shot hits, either. Guns are loud even with a silencer, which only reduces the sound from over 140 decibels to around 85 decibels. That first shot might, even probably, miss, but the sound of the shot going off is going to startle that wizard something fierce.

I don't know what the maximum effective range for a wand is, but I doubt that it is further than a pistol or shotgun's. Against a rifle, no contest.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 10th, 2013, 8:22 pm

On topic, there is a part of chapter eight that is suddenly in present tense. Is that on purpose?
No, I'm just far too used to writing Pokemon Quest in present tense, and it keeps coming out that way, despite writing this one in past tense. Thought I caught it all, but I guess not. That's what happens when you don't use a beta. If you notice it again in the future, just quote the section and I'll do my best to fix it.

On the anti-tech debate, I don't plan on going deep into the "how" and "why" of the matter. This story is not particularly deep, it's just something I'm writing for fun. Harry may figure something about how to make electronics work around Hogwarts, but for the most part, he's going to be bereft of electronic gadgets while at school. Purely mechanical gadgets on the other hand...

On the gun vs. magic debate, I don't plan on going into this one either, not in this story. Batman doesn't use guns, and that's a firm rule for his proteges, along with no killing (which is going to be an interesting reconciliation with the prophecy), so Harry won't be enchanting any guns to be more effective in this story.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Minion » January 10th, 2013, 11:02 pm

I am seriously intrigued by the concept but haven't had the chance to read the parts yet, just skimming everyone's posts. But I have been obsessing with the fact that it's nameless. How about "Between Jobs and Worlds" or Between Muggles and Mount Justice"?
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 11th, 2013, 2:02 am

Part Ten!
Spoiler: show
Harry didn’t worry for the next few days, but after a week with no contact, Harry became concerned. Kent might be old, but he wasn’t senile, he wouldn’t forget something like Harry’s birthday.

After that, Harry started bugging Bruce about Kent’s whereabouts. Just a little bit each day, to start, but after two weeks, Harry was really starting to worry. Even when he went on walkabout, Kent made sure to call or send a postcard, but now… nothing.

Harry knew Bruce was doing his own searches, but it wasn’t enough. Not for Harry to feel satisfied.

So he hacked the Bat Computer.

Or rather, he convinced Dick to hack the Bat Computer for him, since his skills weren’t quite up to the task.

Unfortunately, the Bat Computer still wasn’t able to turn up anything. Probably not surprising, since Bruce had been using the same computer, but it made Harry feel better.

At least, until week three started. By that point, Harry was so worried that Alfred was quietly making all Harry’s favorites just to keep him from going off the deep end.

The only saving grace was the hint that Ra’s Al Ghul was on the move. Batman practically stuffed Robin and Harrier in the Batwing and headed for Florida.

“Can we just agree that there’s no point for me to be here?” Harrier complained.

“Better than you going nuts at the Manor,” Robin muttered.

“I am not going – you know what? We all know what’s going to happen. I’m eleven and even I’ve figured it out. We fight a bunch of League of Shadows fodder, then some elite guards, then Talia shows up and tries to turn Batman evil, then Ra’s and Batman fight until Talia steps in on the side of the man she likes more that week. Then we all go home and do it again in six months to a year.”

“After six hundred years, you tend to get stuck in your ways,” Batman said.

“Still doesn’t explain what he’s doing in Cape Canaveral,” Robin added. “Seems pretty high-tech for Ra’s.”

“Which is why we’re investigating. Whatever Ra’s is doing here, it isn’t good.”

0oOo0

As a matter of fact, it wasn’t good.

Actually, sending a satellite into orbit with the express purpose of using it to wipe out major population centers and kill off most of the world’s population could easily be considered the opposite of good.

It did, however, explain why he was in Cape Canaveral.

But in the end, Batman and Robin stopped the satellite while Harrier delayed Ra’s back up, not that they would have arrived in time anyways.

Still, the fight with Ra’s wasn’t what Harrier was thinking about on the way back to Gotham. No, he was thinking about the news that Batman received just after the fight.

The Team had found Kent Nelson. He had been captured and tortured by Abra Kadabra and Klarion the Witch Boy, both looking for the Helmet of Fate. The Team had kept them from getting their hands on it, but not before Klarion killed Kent.

0oOo0

Red Tornado was the one chosen to give Kent Nelson’s eulogy, the rain fitting Harrier’s mood. Even after everyone’s said their piece, even after everyone else has left, Harrier stood there. Just staring at the grave.

“At least you’re back with your wife. I know how much you missed her.”

Harrier didn’t react when Batman’s shadow appeared next to him. “Why would somebody do something like that? He was a nice old man. He didn’t hurt anyone. Why would anybody want to kill him? It just doesn’t make sense!”

Batman clapped a hand on Harrier’s shoulder. “The world doesn’t make sense. Good people die. Bad people live. People you love get taken away from you too soon. But you go on. You keep moving. You do what you can. In our case, we change the world.”

“I’m gonna get him for this. Klarion, I’m gonna get him. I don’t care what he is, chaos incarnate or not, I’m going to train and work and learn until I make sure he’s not able to hurt anyone like this ever again.”
Good idea, Minion, but maybe Between Magic and Mount Justice instead? I'm gonna sleep on it.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Tempest Kitsune » January 11th, 2013, 9:41 am

Hoo boy. What do you think Harry's reaction will be if/when someone lets slip that Kent is still inside the Helmet? Also, do you think he'd call Nabu on being kind of an asshat when it comes to the whole thing with possessing Zatara? Seriously, permission under duress shouldn't count as a magically binding contract. At the very least he'd probably call him as bad a Klarion.
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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Minion » January 11th, 2013, 3:52 pm

Good idea, Minion, but maybe Between Magic and Mount Justice instead? I'm gonna sleep on it.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby MrRigger2 » January 11th, 2013, 5:47 pm

Part Eleven!
Spoiler: show
Bruce, Dick, and Harry stood amongst the hustle and bustle of King’s Cross, surveying the area. Bruce ignored the people who recognized him with the ease of long practice. “So, where are we going again?” he asked aloud.

“Platform Nine-and-Three-Quarters is what the ticket says,” Harry said.

“I wonder if there’s a Platform Nine-and-a-Half?” Dick wondered. “Maybe Ten-and-Five-Eighths?”

“Professor McGonagall said we had to walk through the wall between Platforms Nine and Ten to get there.”

“Well, I suppose if you want to hide something, inside a wall would be a good place for it,” Bruce mused. “But we should probably get going if you’re going to make the train on time.”

The trio moved towards the two Platforms, keeping their eyes open. Dick saw it first, while Bruce was chatting up one of the female conductors. A family of outlandishly dressed people disappeared as they walked straight at the brick wall between Platform Nine and Ten. He pointed it out, and they worked their way over to the gateway. Moments later, they were surrounded by people in robes and outrageous combinations of regular clothes.

“There are Rogues with better fashion sense than these people. Two-Face has better clothes,” Harry whispered.

“Maybe magic destroys your sense of color coordination?” Dick theorized.

“Well, are we just going to stand here, or are we going to load you up on the train? No need to stare,” Bruce directed.

0oOo0

“What’s this, George?”

“Looks like an ickle firstie in our compartment, Fred.”

“Probably bound for Ravenclaw.”

“True, he’s reading already.”

“I didn’t realize compartments were assigned,” Harry said. “I can find someplace else to sit.”

“No need, stay here.”

“We love to get to know the new students.”

“Our new test subjects.”

“Not going to be an easy mark for us, will you?”

Harry blinked as he looked back and forth between the twins. “What do you mean, test subject?”

“You don’t know who we are?”

“Perfectionist pranksters.”

“Twin terrors of taunting talent.”

“Fred Weasley, the smart one.”

“George Weasley, the pretty one.”

“Harry Potter.”

The twins paused, frozen in mid-double-handshake. “Really?”

“The Harry Potter?”

“Going to have to keep him away from ickle Ginny.”

“Indeed, dear brother.”

Harry interrupted. “What do you mean by The Harry Potter?”

“What do you mean, what do we mean?”

“We nearly always mean what we say.”

“Why would I be The Harry Potter, as opposed to any other Harry Potter?”

“You really don’t know?”

“How wouldn’t you know?”

“He must be like Charlie.”

“You mean he’s so used to being famous that he thinks it’s normal?”

“Just like Charlie doesn’t think dragons are dangerous.”

“And vicious.”

“And fire-breathing carnivores that want to eat him.”

“Crispy with a side of potatoes.”

“You still haven’t answered my question.”

“I suppose we haven’t.”

“Story time?”

“Go fetch Lee and tell him to bring his tarantula down here.”

“Start without me, I’ve heard Dad tell it a million times.”

0oOo0

“You know, that doesn’t make any sense, right?” Harry asked as Fred finished.

“It’s the story everyone knows.”

“That doesn’t mean it’s accurate. I mean, I was a baby. What could I have done to beat someone who was supposed to be so powerful that he terrified the entire country?”

“Nobody knows for sure. All we know is that You-Know-Who walked in, and you were the only one to survive. You must have had something to do with defeating him.”

“But there’s so many holes in the story. And besides, if I’m so famous, why didn’t Professor McGonagall tell me about this when she talked to me?”

Fred grinned. “Oh, she’s an interesting one, that McGonagall. A real hard case. Must not have wanted you to get a swelled head.”

“She didn’t seem so strict to me.”

Fred laughed. “Just wait until she finds you messing about in class, or breaking the rules. Then you’ll find out just how strict she can be.”

George and Lee Jordan exploded into the room, arguing about something, when they noticed they had arrived at their destination. Lee took a long look at Harry, noticing the scar on his forehead, and shrugged. “Okay, I guess you were right.”

“About time you admitted it. Would I ever lie to you?” George protested.

“In a heartbeat, and twice on Sunday,” Lee responded without a moment’s hesitation.

“Lee, I’m hurt.”

“I’m not even going to dignify that with a response.” Lee turned to face Harry. “I’m Lee Jordan. Whatever you do, don’t ever take anything edible from either of these two. It won’t keep you safe from every prank, but it’ll keep you away from most of them.”

“Harry Potter. I’ll keep that in mind.”

Fred nudged Harry over. “Alright Lee, let’s see that tarantula you were telling us about.”

Before Lee could retrieve his pet, the compartment door opened again. “So, I hear Harry Potter’s in here. That’s you, then?”

“I suppose I am,” Harry answered, “though I’m thinking of changing my name if I keep getting reactions like this. And you are?”

“Malfoy, Draco Malfoy. And these two are Crabbe and Goyle.”

Fred and George stifled snickers of laughter.

“And what are you two laughing about? You two are obviously Weasleys; my father told me all about you. Red hair, freckles, and not enough brains to stop having children they can’t afford.” Draco sneered at the twins and turned back to Harry. “You’ll soon find out that some wizarding families are much better than others. You don’t want to fall in with the wrong sort.”

The twins lost their jovial looks and turned red with anger. “What was that, Malfoy?”

“I think he was volunteering to be our test subject for the year.”

“And to think we were going to give him a chance to prove he wasn’t a copy of his father.”

“Guess he ruined his chance of that happening.”

“Wishful thinking on our part, George.”

“You run along now, little Malfoy.”

“And keep your mouth shut about our family.”

“Or we’ll make your life at Hogwarts so miserable you’ll be begging your daddy to transfer you to Beauxbatons.”

Draco flushed as he seemed to realize his mistake. Crabbe and Goyle may have been big, but they weren’t big enough to deal with two angry third years with an axe to grind.

“Just remember what I said, Potter,” he sneered as he stalked out of the compartment, his minions in tow.
Yeah, I think I'm going to go with Between Magic and Mount Justice as the title. I like it.

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Re: Unnamed Harry Potter/Young Justice Xover

Unread postby Tempest Kitsune » January 11th, 2013, 5:51 pm

Harry's habit of analytical thinking is going to make him an odder duck than Luna when she arrives next year, isn't it?
"Doesn't matter what the press says. Doesn't matter what the politicians or the mobs say. Doesn't matter if the whole country decides that something wrong is something right. This nation was founded on one principle above all else: the requirement that we stand up for what we believe, no matter the odds or the consequences. When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world — "No, you move."
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