A Discussion on 'Villains made Good Guys' Pairings

[Daethalion]

Okay, attempting to jump the train back onto the tracks...

As has been said before, I'm also of the persuasion that the good girl / bad guy pairing-conversion is only plausible if the bad guy was on his way to switching sides already. One thing I have not seen discussed here, however, is the idea of a pairing resulting in a good person who ultimately becomes one of the villains. To me, that'd be a lot more interesting.

A very good example of why the bad-good conversion usually doesn't work is actually presented in the filler arc of timeskip Naruto involving the Sanbi, with the relationship between Guren and Yuukimaru. Yes, I know that's not romance, no I don't care - it still follows the pattern. What really got to me, though, was not only the incredibly short time it took for the conversion to happen at all, but that it was so complete that it effectively made a cold-blooded ruthless mass murderer into a tree-hugging pansy that was no longer capable of defending herself against her own minions. There is such a thing as going too far to make a point.

Overall the concept just doesn't appeal to me that much anyway. Besides the far fetched nature of the whole process, there's something else to consider - depending on the 'rank' of the villain being converted, a writer can easily destroy any antagonistic elements with which to continue his / her story simply by having no real material source left to work with, unless they decide to go with an OC. This is tantamount to writer suicide.

[doc.exe]

Those are good points, and I agree the redemption of any character needs to be done carefully and well in order to not write your own tomb.

As to "good guy/girl make bad pairing", to tell the truth I don't exactly like that concept. Mostly because I believe it lends itself for the converted character to be nothing else than a mindless pawn for the villian, something that is not that appealing to me.

In any case, I actually like the concept of the Fallen Hero as it makes for a great and complex villian or antivillian. But just as with the Atoner, I believe it is better implemented when it doesn't have anything to do with a pairing at all.

[LightLink17]

Given how popular it is to ship people on opposite sides of conflict, it amazes me that people don't use Stockholm Syndrome as a plot device more often. I've seen it done only once that I can remember, in an HP fic featuring Dark!Harry and Ginny.

Doing so, at least in my opinion, would not only help in believability, but plot. The mechanics of it would be interesting to delve in to.

Then again, I guess the reason people don't use it is because people don't know about it, and it'd be no easier to write than any other way of getting two such people together in the first place.

[Phht]

Fallen Heroes are interesting, and to be honest, the pairing shouldn't be the major or direct cause of a fall. Having some influence, I don't mind. After all, it's a slippery slope separating Hero from Villain, and enough influences - including pairing - might serve together as enough to give the hero the push to slip down the slope.

By the same token, redeeming a fallen hero shouldn't be solely due to the pairing. Maybe the other half of the pair is helping and encouraging them, but it can't be that easy to climb back up a slippery slope you've already slid down once. It's a slippery slope, not an escalator, ya know?

Pairings are not cruise control for redemption (but Caps Lock IS cruise control for cool ).

[doc.exe]

That's what I think, really. The pairing can be a helping factor, but it can't be the sole driver in the change of a character's moral alignment.