Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby MEKristian » November 13th, 2015, 12:24 pm

It's highly unlikely that Cloud is a ballot character; the Ballot only ended last month, and it takes much longer than that to develop a character.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby JamestheFox » November 13th, 2015, 1:10 pm

True. Cloud may have just been on their list from the start, in which case WHAT THE WHAT?

WHY? HOW?

Nintendo: "To show that we could. To show that we can have anyone we want in our massive crossover event."

Well, they're supposedly working on a Smash presentation next month, so... Yeah, this could get crazy.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby Phht » November 13th, 2015, 1:28 pm

Nintendo: "To show that we could. To show that we can have anyone we want in our massive crossover event."
So next up is Naruto, Luffy, and Nanoha? ;)
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby JamestheFox » November 13th, 2015, 2:39 pm

You know what, at this point I'm not sure I could count their like out. We'll see in December, I guess.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » November 15th, 2015, 1:00 am

That Direct was an incredible return to form after such a long absence. I wasn’t expecting much but came away really pleased with it. The only downside is that my wallet is going to hate me at least until next Spring, especially considering the current dollar parity.

In addition, I did a spit-take when I saw the announcement trailer with Cloud. It certainly seems surprising given he is not a character that is usually associated with Nintendo systems. Now, some people have pointed out that the same could be said about Solid Snake (in Brawl) and Ryu, but at least those two had some of their mainline games ported or remade for Nintendo consoles. Cloud has only some minor cameos at best in games like Theatrhythm Final Fantasy or Kingdom Hearts: Chains of Memories.

It makes me wonder about crazy possibilities, like the Final Fantasy VII remake targeting the NX. Given that Dragon Quest XI is rumored to also be in production for that platform, anything seems possible at this point.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » November 21st, 2015, 2:42 pm

Finally got around to watching Sword Art Online. A little late, but better later than never.

Anyway, found it to be awesome and it seems that it would be worth my while to find the light novel series and read it as well. While the premise has been done before (.//hack, Otherland, etc), it was done very well and actually explored some of the psychology of what that would do to people. Touched lightly, but still explored it to a degree.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby JamestheFox » November 23rd, 2015, 10:16 am

I like Sword Art Online as well, though the main character... not a huge fan. Also, MMOs are generally focused on the multiplayer experience. Kirito's lone wolf thing might fly in the early game, but later on you would think he'd need a full party or something. Then again, the creator of Aincrad did have a bit of a focus on the power of one, so it's reasonable that he'd have designed it such that a single powerful player could turn the tides. My other complaint is that, for someone said to be bad at the social stuff and a lone wolf, he sure seems to be very good at gathering (girl)friends and generally being likable.

If you're still hungering for SAO, there is an Abridged Series, which is loads of fun and uses a lot more of the standard MMO trends in its storytelling.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » November 24th, 2015, 9:54 pm

I liked Sword Art Online on the whole, but I think Accel World (based on another light novel series from the same author of SAO) was better.

Kirito didn’t annoy me, at least not as much as he has many other people, although I think he skirts very dangerously the line to be... well, essentially, a Gary Stu (I don’t think he really is one, not quite at least, but he certainly has too many characteristics of one). The things that DID annoy me were the many harem tropes present in the series, some of which genuinely irked me, like the “little sister” subplot in the second arc. Mind you, Accel World also has its share of harem tropes, but I don’t think they were as overt or as blatant.

The pacing of the Aincrad arc was also… well, kind of terrible to be honest, particularly in its second half.

Those complaints aside, what fascinated me of this series was indeed the psychological and emotional exploration of the characters, which was quite good at showing the toll that their situation was taking on them. And I think the second season, especially the Phantom Bullet and Mother’s Rosario arcs were even better than the first season in those respects. Mother’s Rosario, for instance, got to me on an emotional level that very few series have done lately.

Now if you are interested in more of this “trapped in/transported to an MMORPG world” subgenre that seems to have become so popular recently, allow me to recommend Log Horizon. It’s quite good, although the emphasis is different from SAO. In an oddity for this kind of series, it focuses on the tribulations, politics and logistics of a new societal order formed by the players that were transported to this MMORPG world, up to including the creation of their own form of government, not to mention their relationships and conflicts with the native people who are no longer mindless NPC. Don’t think the emphasis on politics makes it a boring series though, there is still plenty of action and comedy. I recently started watching the second season and I’m still enjoying it quite a lot.

I also think it uses the trappings of a MMORPG better than SAO. For instance, the main character is not a solitary ubber powerful warrior, but a mage in a supporting role that specializes in status buffs and is quite weak at the offensive level. The thing is that he is actually a master strategist who is incredibly good at deceiving and manipulating his opponents, as well as coordinating the attacks and actions of his party members. And yes, he also gets his share of girls that end falling in love with him, but thankfully the series doesn’t play at all like a stereotypical harem anime.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » November 25th, 2015, 3:52 pm

Eh, I admit that SAO has some weaknesses and that things could have been paced better and expanded. Well, with the Aincrad and Fairy Dance arcs. Reki Kawahara was still cutting his teeth in writing when he started, so the story developments were a bit rougher. Accel World and latter arcs of SAO show how he improved in his writing. Still haven't watched the Phantom Bullet and Mother's Rosario arcs, but have heard some good things about them, which indicates that the story needed some time to grow the beard.

The pacing was definitely a weak point in the series. How much of it was from lack of material from the light novels, and how much of it was a design decision is up to debate, but things could have been paced better and expanded upon. As for the harem tropes, they really aren't a major component to the story by and large considering that despite his being desirable to the ladies, Kirito only has eyes for Asuna. The girls quickly learn to accept it.

As for Log Horizon, the fact that it concentrates on the societal aspects of things is definitely interesting and I should check it out.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby Phht » November 25th, 2015, 4:19 pm

I never got through the ALO arc of SAO. I honestly thought it was a different season than the SAO arc at first because the first arc ended on what very much seemed like a season/series finale note. As to why I never got through it... well, it just seemed to lack pretty much everything that made the first arc so interesting. Die? Just respawn. Get tired? Log out. All the worries and concerns and how people adapt to being trapped there, not present at all. There wasn't any pressure or worry about playing other than the "have to rescue her before evil man marries her comatose body" plot point deadline. As a result, I never got more than 1-2 eps into the ALO arc, much less continue on to the second season.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » November 27th, 2015, 4:20 am

Eh, the ALO arc takes a bit to gain momentum and I agree that the Aincrad arc ended in a way that would be appropriate for a series finisher. It helps to think of the ALO arc as dealing with the fallout and consequences of the Aincrad arc, and that there would be those who would exploit those events to their own ends. Also, it does set the general tone for the rest of the SAO series, which is more based on exploring the psychology of things, which is very apparent in the second season.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » November 29th, 2015, 11:20 pm

Yeah, I have read that Sword Art Online was the first novel of the author. In that sense, it is understandable that he was still learning the ropes and that subsequent novels improved. Still, I stand by my criticism of the pacing in the anime adaptation =P.

Now, I have not read the novels yet, but I have heard that supposedly some plot points are developed better in them (which wouldn’t really surprise me), so it makes me wonder if the pacing of the Aincrad arc would have been better if they had dedicated more episodes to it. Of course, as you say, the question then is if the novels just didn’t have enough material for them to adapt a full season of 24 episodes dedicated to Aincrad.

Interestingly, while the Fairy Dance arc starts slow, it’s on the whole better paced than the Aincrad arc.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » December 1st, 2015, 8:54 pm

It was largely due to lack of material. The Aincrad arc only really took up two of the novels from what I've heard, and the second one was mostly side stories, many of which have plot relevance, but were otherwise not tied with the grind to the top. While that seems to be fairly minimalist in terms of covering two years, there's only so much you can do with enter floor, kill all the mobs, find boss, kill boss, rinse, repeat. Thus, they only covered major events from Kirito's perspective.

Due to that, it only took up 14 episodes, though they may have been able to scrape one or two more out of it by fleshing out things that were glossed over. Honestly, it's a known issue with adapting something from a different medium. It's easier with manga, but can be harder with light novels if there's not enough material to fill an entire season.

And just because I liked the anime doesn't mean I don't realize that there were a lot of things that could have been improved. Also, the series had significant hype and failed to live up to it. It's actually one of the reasons I wait a bit before watching a series, and usually only do so if someone recommends it to me. That's what got me to watch SAO in the first place.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby Phht » December 6th, 2015, 1:11 am

Ace Combat 7 announced and will be taking the franchise back to the strangereal setting of the other numbered AC games~ :D

Also, it'll apparently be having options for the VR stuff on PS4. I'm just hoping they do a PC release of it at the same time.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » December 6th, 2015, 7:23 am

Nice. I haven't played as much of that series as I could have over the years, different genre than my preferred games, but I've always liked the series.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » December 7th, 2015, 2:28 am

It was largely due to lack of material. The Aincrad arc only really took up two of the novels from what I've heard, and the second one was mostly side stories, many of which have plot relevance, but were otherwise not tied with the grind to the top. While that seems to be fairly minimalist in terms of covering two years, there's only so much you can do with enter floor, kill all the mobs, find boss, kill boss, rinse, repeat. Thus, they only covered major events from Kirito's perspective.

Due to that, it only took up 14 episodes, though they may have been able to scrape one or two more out of it by fleshing out things that were glossed over. Honestly, it's a known issue with adapting something from a different medium. It's easier with manga, but can be harder with light novels if there's not enough material to fill an entire season.

And just because I liked the anime doesn't mean I don't realize that there were a lot of things that could have been improved. Also, the series had significant hype and failed to live up to it. It's actually one of the reasons I wait a bit before watching a series, and usually only do so if someone recommends it to me. That's what got me to watch SAO in the first place.
Fair points.

Indeed, I remember SAO received its share of backlash back then. That also made me a bit reticent to watch it at first, but it turned out to be better than I expected and enjoyable despite its flaws.

------

And well, on a completely different topic that nevertheless is related announcements and trailers shown at the PlayStation Experience:
Spoiler: show
Even if it wasn’t my favorite of the Final Fantasy games from the PS1 era, I have to admit I’m excited for this remake, and its production values are quite impressive.

Also, while some purists are already protesting, I’m not surprised that they changed the battle system to make it more similar to Crisis Core or FFXV, so that doesn’t bothers me. What do concerns me a bit is that it seems… “Grittier” than I remember the original game being. FFVII was actually one of the darkest entries in the series but it retained some of the zaniness of the SNES games. I hope that was not expunged completely, it would irk me a lot if, for example, things like the part where you have to cross-dress were removed.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby Wraith5 » December 7th, 2015, 2:44 am

On a somewhat ('barely') related note, I found the 'suplex a train' video from FF6 while looking up a similar thing from a different game. Then the video where Sabin suplexes himself. Holy hell I laughed so hard...
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » December 7th, 2015, 9:01 pm


Fair points.

Indeed, I remember SAO received its share of backlash back then. That also made me a bit reticent to watch it at first, but it turned out to be better than I expected and enjoyable despite its flaws.
I tend to avoid the hype train for that reason. SAO was actually recommended to me a couple of years ago while I was still stationed down in Georgia, but I moved to a new job. After that, lost said job and am going to school. Finally got around to watching it and found it enjoyable, flaws and all.
And well, on a completely different topic that nevertheless is related announcements and trailers shown at the PlayStation Experience:
Spoiler: show
Even if it wasn’t my favorite of the Final Fantasy games from the PS1 era, I have to admit I’m excited for this remake, and its production values are quite impressive.

Also, while some purists are already protesting, I’m not surprised that they changed the battle system to make it more similar to Crisis Core or FFXV, so that doesn’t bothers me. What do concerns me a bit is that it seems… “Grittier” than I remember the original game being. FFVII was actually one of the darkest entries in the series but it retained some of the zaniness of the SNES games. I hope that was not expunged completely, it would irk me a lot if, for example, things like the part where you have to cross-dress were removed.
Oh, they wouldn't take that bit away, if only because it is an iconic and hilarious event for Cloud. Also, the "Grittier" appearance actually makes sense. The original FFVII was gritty by the standards of the day, but would be rather tame by today's standards. As for the battle system changes, I can find myself actually approving of them, largely due to the fact that FFVII would actually do pretty well as an Action RPG, which the series had been transitioning to anyway.

Yes, the changes take away from the original in a way, but I would rather a game that is its' own thing, rather than a slavish copy of the original.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
Don't forget: Mass Effect is powered by magic space rocks. Evangelion is powered by Your Mom.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » December 15th, 2015, 4:26 am

I don’t mind some changes as certainly I wouldn’t like a mere carbon copy of the original with just better visuals. I just hope they don’t lose complete sight of the original’s “essence”, I suppose.

While FFXVII was certainly a very gritty game for its time, it also had many moments of levity and silliness (like the section where you had to disguise as a Shinra Soldier and the accompanying parade minigame, the disguises of Red XIII and Barret at the Cargo Ship, the slap-off between Tifa and Scarlet, the possible dates with other characters at the Gold Saucer, meeting Hojo while he is relaxing at Costa del Sol, meeting the Turks while they are on their day off at Wu Tai, the “sacrifice” of Caith Sith at the Temple of the Ancients, or in general just some of the funny lines that your party members could say at different points in the game).

Now, it has been confirmed that the section where Cloud cross-dresses is going to be keep, so that gives me relief that at least not all that zaniness will be expunged.

The thing that worries me now is that they have announced the game will be released in episodic form. I kind of understand why they are doing that, as given the size of the original, remaking everything at that level of detail shown in the trailer would likely result in a very prolonged development cycle, and that’s even if they are planning to cut content. After what happened with the FFXIII trilogy, not to mention FFXV and KH3 (which have not even been released yet) I think Square might be very reticent to have another game of that scale and magnitude in production for such a long time.

In that sense, I understand why they are dividing the game into parts and, looking back at the structure of the original game there are actually sections in the storyline were they could make a clean break into “Acts”. The thing that truly bothers me of this decision is that, if every episode is a self-contained game, it could essentially mean that most sections of the world will become self-contained as well, and that the interlocking world of the original that you could explore at your own leisure will be lost.

Of course, given Kitase comments that every area is going to be expanded and have more content included, that might not matter in the end.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby MEKristian » December 16th, 2015, 12:34 am



The Final Smash direct. Get ready for mixed feelings.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » December 16th, 2015, 6:52 am

I don’t mind some changes as certainly I wouldn’t like a mere carbon copy of the original with just better visuals. I just hope they don’t lose complete sight of the original’s “essence”, I suppose.

While FFXVII was certainly a very gritty game for its time, it also had many moments of levity and silliness (like the section where you had to disguise as a Shinra Soldier and the accompanying parade minigame, the disguises of Red XIII and Barret at the Cargo Ship, the slap-off between Tifa and Scarlet, the possible dates with other characters at the Gold Saucer, meeting Hojo while he is relaxing at Costa del Sol, meeting the Turks while they are on their day off at Wu Tai, the “sacrifice” of Caith Sith at the Temple of the Ancients, or in general just some of the funny lines that your party members could say at different points in the game).

Now, it has been confirmed that the section where Cloud cross-dresses is going to be keep, so that gives me relief that at least not all that zaniness will be expunged.

The thing that worries me now is that they have announced the game will be released in episodic form. I kind of understand why they are doing that, as given the size of the original, remaking everything at that level of detail shown in the trailer would likely result in a very prolonged development cycle, and that’s even if they are planning to cut content. After what happened with the FFXIII trilogy, not to mention FFXV and KH3 (which have not even been released yet) I think Square might be very reticent to have another game of that scale and magnitude in production for such a long time.

In that sense, I understand why they are dividing the game into parts and, looking back at the structure of the original game there are actually sections in the storyline were they could make a clean break into “Acts”. The thing that truly bothers me of this decision is that, if every episode is a self-contained game, it could essentially mean that most sections of the world will become self-contained as well, and that the interlocking world of the original that you could explore at your own leisure will be lost.

Of course, given Kitase comments that every area is going to be expanded and have more content included, that might not matter in the end.
Even if they make it episodic, there is a lot they can do with that. You are right in that there are areas which can serve as clear breaks though. The hard part will be finding the right point. Also, while Final Fantasy has been consistently trending towards linear design, they might go the path of Type-0, where you still have a world map, exploration and questing options, and so on. Still a very linear game, but you still had plenty of things to do, though you had to choose carefully on which events and quests you wanted to do.

The remake is probably going to be more like that, with some events and quests being mutually exclusive, time gated, or simply impractical to do before you have to advance the plot based on where in the game you are. That added some spice to the linearity of Type-0, and I can see it work for the remake.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby doc.exe » December 19th, 2015, 7:27 pm

The Final Smash direct. Get ready for mixed feelings.
Got to admit this is the third time they manage to surprise me, as even after Cloud and Ryu, I still didn’t really expect they would include Bayonetta. I’m sad that Snake never managed to come back, but considering the whole drama that has transpired this year with the separation of Hideo Kojima from Konami, I suppose including Snake again just proved impossible.

Now, while Corrin actually looks like an interesting character (even if he is another swordfighter, his play style at least looks significantly different from Marth, Lucina, Ike or Roy), I think his inclusion slants the rooster too heavily in Fire Emblem’s direction. Right now, it’s tied with Pokémon in the number of characters and the only other franchise with more representation in the game is the Mario series itself. I would have preferred a different character in that sense, like the Splatoon squid kids, Chibi Robo, Shovel Knight, or Geno.

In any case, it has been a good run in terms of DLC support. Now I suppose it’s only a matter of time before we see the next Smash Bros. for the NX.
Even if they make it episodic, there is a lot they can do with that. You are right in that there are areas which can serve as clear breaks though. The hard part will be finding the right point. Also, while Final Fantasy has been consistently trending towards linear design, they might go the path of Type-0, where you still have a world map, exploration and questing options, and so on. Still a very linear game, but you still had plenty of things to do, though you had to choose carefully on which events and quests you wanted to do.

The remake is probably going to be more like that, with some events and quests being mutually exclusive, time gated, or simply impractical to do before you have to advance the plot based on where in the game you are. That added some spice to the linearity of Type-0, and I can see it work for the remake.
Honestly, when they made the initial announcement, I was expecting them to give FFVII something akin to the Open World treatment of FFXV, rather than the more linear, “confined” treatment of FFXIII. But who knows, I think I saw an interview with Kitase stating that you could explore some areas like Midgard further than you did in the original game. Makes me wonder how exactly they will approach the design of each area, but we will see.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby MEKristian » December 24th, 2015, 12:15 pm



I think trying to explain this would only ruin the insanity and magic involved.
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby jgkitarel » December 24th, 2015, 12:36 pm

Whoah, that was nice and very well done. Well, looks like I know what I'm going to be ordering after I get paid.

That was very well done, and the animation was very good as well. MEK, you found a real gem here.
Also, I have to punch you, jgkitarel, because I spent a lot of time on the nanoha wiki trying to locate information on mages being trained due to being above a certain rank, only to remember and confirm that you were the one that came up with that. - Phht
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Re: Yet Another Random Bit of Insanity

Unread postby MEKristian » December 24th, 2015, 2:03 pm

I wouldn't say I found it, since it's both new and I follow half the group's other youtube offerings anyways.
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